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The Weekly Cheek
The Weekly Cheek

Episode · 4 months ago

81. The power of parasocial relationships

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In this episode, we're discussing parasocial relationships and some of the overly-familiar messages we've received to our Instagram!

Find us online at cheekmedia.com.au and on socials @cheekmediaco, and become a Patron for $4 per month!

Hello, I'm Christin PARISONATO and I'm Hannah Ferguson and where co founders a cheek media. This is the weekly Cheek podcast. Before we start this podcast, I would like to acknowledge that we are UN stolen land of the Yagura and tourable people. This was and always will be aboriginal land. Welcome back to the weekly cheek. Welcome. Today we're going to talk about Paras social relationship. Or do you think of Paras social relationship? Is a relationship where well, a non relationship? I don't think it's. Well, I think it is a relationship. I don't fight eight Um. I think it's it's so the easiest way to explain it is like between a fan and the celebrity, because a fan is getting all of this information from a celebrity, watching their interviews, consuming their content and it's fully one sided, and then the fan feels like there's something there that there's not. I think they have an assumption of who that person is and they don't actually know them. But I think that Paras social relationship unfortunately has the word relationship in it. Yeah, I'd have a problem with that. I don't think it's a relationship. But I think what we were talking about just before we started, Um, was that I think Paras social relationships can be too sided, because it doesn't just mean celebrity fan. That's obviously the most obvious example, but what we're talking about was there are people that I follow, that people I've met or people that you know, I used to know, that follow me. I follow them, but I probably will never see them again, Um, and so literally my entire knowledge of their life is only what I see them post and actively share through social media. I think it is different. If you like, for example, like if it's someone from school who you were was, who you were friends with, I think that kind of changes the flavor of it right. I also think there's okay. So, for example, Um, it's probably people that follow cheek who are public figures of some sort who follow us personally. So they have a following, we have following. Um. Neither of US are celebrities. There's nothing like that. There's just some sort of public element to our lives. Um. What then? I don't know them, they don't know me. We're both have some sort of small platform. What then? Well, I think that the I think that it's about how you, I guess how the person with like less fame. I don't know how to say it Um to be like all encompassing, but but it's. The problem becomes when one party feels as though they like either know the other party or have some kind of right to the other party. Absolutely when it's not reciprocal. Because that's my problem with it being a relation. Like saying relationship, not like is it? What can a relationship be? One sided? Like if you have a stalker, do you ever? Is that a relationship, a stalking relationship? But I think that relationships that. I think I'm not sure if that's a binary way of thinking about relationships, because...

...they can be like. This is taking it a bit further. But okay, in the ocean there are parasitic relationships. Not just in the ocean for this, parasitic relationships everywhere on land as well. fucking idiot. Natural Geographic documentary should be watched by me. Um, like barn. You're talking about barning. Yes, they have a relationship. They are in relation to each other. That's the thing about a relationship. is about looking at the relative positions of the parties and how they are connected. When they're one way. I get what you're saying. It's not a two way street, so it's not a relationship because the connection is purely formed one person's assumption of another. But I do think that's a bit reductive. I think in terms of like the actual like the correct usage of the word, it probably is correct and I probably don't have any like to stand on there, but I think that I just have a problem with it being called a relationship. I get what you're saying. I totally actually fundamentally agree with you, but I've found it fun to argue that because I knew it. The thing is, I know that I am like factually incorrect, but I just hate that they called that and I just think that makes it so much more toxic from a moral standpoint. You're right. From a factual standpoint, I'm right. Correct. Cool, glad be established that. Yes, do you want to leave with the story? Yes. So the reason that this podcast came about is because I've read an article, Um, and I don't I don't think it was that personal really. I don't think it was personal. I think you are one of the least willing to give out personal information people I know. Thank you, Um, what a compliment, even when you I feel like you're saying something personal. It's always like I know, my standard view is different, so I'll be like that was really personal quaint, because I know for you, but it's it's not. Yes, the other thing is like for me, I'm like we're much more willing to give the facts of a personal thing, but I'm like, I'm going to tell you what I feel. Yeah, that's my business, not yours. Anyway. So I write this article on Cheek and we posted on instagram about burnout and it was basically like me, I guess, like kind of chronicling my burnout and like these are some of the markers that made me realize that I have burnt out. And the whole premise of the article was like I'm a tap type a person and this is what my burnout looks like. And that was again why it was not that personal and like the point of my writing it is because I hope that other people would relate, like other people who are like type, type A and like a bit neurotic, which is me, and like very organized and regimented and obsessed with routine, like if I'm not in my routine, I'm like off, and that was that was the point of the article. was like this is what my burnout looks like. It looks like breaking down of my routines because I cannot keep them up, and like it's like smaller things, like I um while I was burnt out quite badly post election, like a few weeks ago, because I'm definitely um much better now, but I like there were emails, and I talked about this in the burnout episode. There were emails that I knew would take me one minute and I just couldn't write them. Um. But I planned an entire conference for work, work...

...in two days, which without too much struggle. I said in the article, I did not prep my lunches for work because I didn't think of it, like I just it's not you, I know, just escaped my mind. Like I work up Monday morning I'm like where my lunch? I don't make it. I know I didn't go grocery shopping. There was like fucking no food in my house and I was just like open the cupboard being like maybe I have some dry sladders, whereas usually you're like I'm making one trip out to for olive bread, but I'm nervous because if I go out in the olive bread. Isn't there a ruin my life? Yes, exactly. That's usually like so regimented to the tea. We are like, how can I secure the olive bread? Well, because for me, if I go to one coals, no olive bread and I'm to another coal's, what the funk? That's so inefficient. I need it. I need to know where it is, where is the olive bread, and I'll go there and I'll pick it up and I'll get it Um and like I'm always like I go grocery shopping every weekend, like everything in my life is like scheduled. That's where I thrive. But then, so I'm talking about this and I'm like I would. One of one of the anecdotes I wrote in the article was like I would go for a walk, hypothetically. Actually didn't in this time, but previously when I've been burnt out, I'm going to go for a nice walk because I'm burnt out and it might be nice to be out in nature, put my headphones in, I mean listen to a podcast. Oh, I can't. I can't listen to a podcasts like I can't have people talking about like that's just too much because I'm trying, I'm thinking a lot and my thoughts are being drowned out by the podcast. Okay, mayble just listen to the music. I know that's annoying to me. There's like too much is going on, because there's the thoughts and there's the music and I'm like trying to like be relaxed. And this happened in and I think I said this in the burnout episode as well, I was driving a lot during the election and I wouldn't have any sounds on in the car because I'm like my again, my thoughts are enough and I can't have anything else and I want, I like podcast to capture me, I like content to capture me and like so I'm thinking about it. I'm not going to like I'm not the person who has something in the background while I'm completely paying attention to something else. So these are the types of examples that I was listing in this article about burnout, and the point of the article was like, this is not me. That's how I figured out I was burnt out because I am acting like not characteristic of myself. Someone came into our D M S and said, it sounds like you have a d h d. have you ever been assessed for a D H D? This person said. I was just diagnosed with a D H D at the same time as my child was. And, Um, you should list you should watch these videos of this woman who talks about a d h d. now, I just want to be really clear and say that I am not offended that someone thought I had a d H d. like I don't find like that's not it's not offensive to assume someone has a personality disorder. What it is is supremely fucked up to read one thing that I have written and think that it's okay to come in and try to diagnose me with with a label, because, and like the...

...thing is, and again, like I just want to be so clear. I'm probably over explaining, but, like, I don't find it offensive. Um, I actually think it's more offensive people who actually have a D H D that it's like you think that it's so it's something that you can, like, yes, pin that, pinned down on one article that you didn't read, like you don't even, and this is the thing, like I'm enough of my personalities on cheek. Like I don't. It wasn't listed on the article that I wrote. It like she didn't even know who wrote it. But also the thing is, even if you did have a D H D, even if you actually in six months or like, I'm going to see a doctor, I'm gonna Blah Blah, and you've got diagnosed, it doesn't change the fact it's not actually about the diagnosis, is not about the accuracy, it's not about the thought, it's not about the care. It's about this person's assumption of who you are and their familiarity and their willingness to impose that on you when they don't know you. Yes, and at the end of the day, I like if you look at characteristics that are typical of a D H D and my personality, complete fucking opposites, which just goes to show how little this person understands about me. I know people with their D H D our brains work in the opposite way, like absolute opposite, and so again just show you to know like you don't. You can't diagnose someone who doing know crazy concept. And the other thing was the article was about how I was acting uncharacteristic of myself, and I'm pretty sure, well, sorry, I'm pretty sure that it was when I was saying that I can't listen to podcast and I was like, I was like, that is I was saying. That's the opposite of how I usually am. Like again, I just think this is really bad for awareness of mental health issues, because a d h d doesn't just fucking pop up when your stress. Like, come on, I'm not a professional, but I know that. I also think that. I think it's important to note that it's clear to both of us that the person wasn't being malicious, inten Chen, but also, I think part of it is, and this is what comes back to our paras social relationship and what we want to talk about today. We know we're not celebrities. Cheek isn't a big deal. Obviously we are seeing success and our audience is growing and we acknowledge that. But I think part of this conversation is people want to engage, and I love that and you love that, but often people don't really engage with the content. They only engage with it to the extent that they can then respond. So, for instance, my view on this, which actually has nothing to do with me, is that this person has read maybe one or two slides and then thought, oh, I have something to contribute, I have something to say and I want to reach out and send these people a message. And let me be clear, I love every most messages that we get right I love responding to every single one that I can. I appreciate it. We don't want that to stop. But sometimes, and I think people can understand this, regardless of you know how many fucking falls on instagram you have, blah, blah, blah, people mess you. People want to put their two cents in...

...about everything. We see it everyday and comments sections. We see it in our own D M, regardless of cheek or whatever. My family and my friends. People love to find something and attach themselves to and impose it on you, and I think it's actually a wider comment about their ability to do this to a fucking stranger and just to take one thing and think I have expertise and I have personal experience and I just have to shove it. But you know the other thing, and I think is this is the big difference. We want people to we want, we always want feedback on our content. I don't want feedback on my myself. That's why I'm not I'm not like an instant celebrity. It is a media platform. I love when people give their own experience, like people giving their own experience of burnout on that like that article, like foot went off. So like so many more Um comments and responses than what I ever expected because people relate, which is which is great. That's kind of the point. I do not want someone to come in to my d M S and be like this is what you are or you should do this, like, and I know there were a few people with like genuine advice and again, like Um. To be honest, I probably not going to take any of it, Um, but you're obviously you're welcome to give it, because I think that some people want to give advice because it's like this is what worked for me and it's it's totally different, and someone else might read that comment and think like, Oh, yeah, I'm going to try that. I'm just stubborn, so I'm not going to take any advice. T sorry, not nothing about you. It's not my problem, but this is not that's not advice. Say like you're a D H D and also like I think the point of cheek is that we're us. I think in recent weeks this is going to be a bit of a struggle because you may have noticed if you're listening to this, then probably over the last few weeks our content is shifting. Right post election. We are wanting to talk about broader things and with that I think has come a few weeks of Um personal engagement with our story. So, like I did the tell us a secret the other weekend, which really went really well, people are very interested to chat about it and it's obviously not about me and people are willingly giving over that information and I was trying to limit that. I don't want to provide feedback. No one asked for advice, they're just telling me a secret. So I said it's the opposite of thing about you. is about exactly secret. But so no, what I mean is, when I was sharing them to story, my understanding of that is, okay, this person has shared this. Some of them I felt compelled to say something too, because I think that's it's irresponsible in some regards not to add something to that and just to post it. But other times I was like yeah, but other times I was like, well, this person hasn't asked for feedback or advice. Only when they really sort of indicated in another message or something that they were looking for something. was I sort of willing to comment. Um, but that's something I was actively thinking about because of what's happened to us. But you know, you've put on stories, you know, about being bisexual. We talked about personal things and the pod personal things and inverted quotations, because there's a lot that you don't know about us, obviously personally, but we realize that this is kind of a stepping stone where...

...we're probably putting more of ourselves on cheek as opposed to just our content, and so that's something that we're kind of hyper aware of at the moment. Is Like, how are we personally engaging with this platform? What do we feel comfortable doing, and at what point is this going to become like really difficult? And I think that's an important conversation to have, like with the tell us a secret. We had a bit of a debate about this and I kind of think it's something I'm willing to talk about. Um, a couple of men, a couple of them, I think it's something to say about it. A couple of men put in the secret box, Um, comments about me being attractive or like just sort of Um, I don't know how to explain it other than like having a go M and I don't know what they were seeking. Um, a reaction. Yeah, that's what I think, and we actually got a man's opinion about this yesterday. Yeah, and the thing I thought about it was like it didn't make me uncomfortable because they didn't like travely messaged me and I just like one of them, the instacrush one, I shared and I was like, I'm sucking using this for followers and I got them by me. But I didn't think you should have done that. No, agree, and I think that the thing that you said was like it's gross right, and my thing is I don't think I said it's grossing. I said we should not be Um, amplifying or highlighting that behavior because I didn't think it's I personally don't think it's acceptable. The thing with the instacrush one was that I thought if a woman had said I would be comfortable. But that's the point. No, men can do things that women can do things to other women that men can't. But I don't know that that's true. That's that's my philosophy. Instacrush doesn't bother me because I don't think it's very obvious. instacrush is a bit different because it's like not overtly sexual. No, that's what I mean. That's why I was like use it. I still wouldn't. I agree. Totally get it, and I was like, well, but that the record reflect that. I disagree. But there was one that I didn't do anything with. It was like, Um, something about like me being a babe or something, and I know you're canceled. Look I the thing I said to you, and this is problematic. I'M gonna say you've brought this on the pod. I don't mind it. It is surprising. You said you know this reaction and I said I don't think it's fair for me to react, Um, like aggressively about it, because if I actively knew they were hot and I found them attractive, would I have the same reaction? So you're walking along the street and someone's like hey, hot stuff, no matter what they look like, no matter what they look like, it's to know what's the difference? There is a difference, because I think that's less aggressive what they've done. It's just the same thing online. No, it's not. You're a babe on the street, you turn around someone who you find personally attractive, I would probably ignore them. Like I did with the instagram thing, and then feel for the rest of the day no comments. I hate that, you...

...know, I hate that. I know I'm canceled. What the followers decide. I just don't think we can't be giving we're going off topic, but we can't be giving hot people past. Sorry, no, I know, but I'm not going to say that. I've never like engaged as in like. What I mean is like if I found someone attractive at a by am, I'm not allowed to go up and to engage in a conversation. That is not the same. No, I know, but what I'm saying is like I'd probably objectify people in my mind, and I know that's not it's not the same. But hang on. is like messaging someone to go out for a drink? The same. No, so what is different about this is on the message. Is that the fact that it's like I would argue that it's harassment. What's happened to me? I'm called that harassment. I don't feel that I'm being harassed, though, and isn't it about how I feel? Yes, yeah, it is, which is why I'm not like fully like Gad are you? If this person had followed it up in any way by messaging cheek or messaging me. I would have been like fuck off and blocked them. So that was just a step to but also, I want to clarify, I don't know what either these people look like. Their profile pictures were not. We're not saying that they were. It's not about it's not about that. It's just opening a conversation. What are you wanted for me to say? What were you saying? What am I responding to right now? Um, what? So my point being that I was saying it was harassed. In my opinion, I would define that as harassment. I see it as like shooting a shot and I left it alone. On a public, like potentially public way. The fuck no made but I would be I would feel more uncomfortable if they had private message because they don't know you and because of the Paras social relationship, because if they came through cheek, they saw you on cheek and they're like I gonna go follow her person and sliding at her d m that is like objectively creepy behavior. But they didn't know. I know, but this is what I'm saying. Like what I'm saying. If they had done that, I would feel that way? Yes, but if this is easily ignored, it's worse to be whether you ignored or not, it still happened. No, I know, but like, I think being catcored is way more aggressive than that. But I don't think that we can I don't think that you ignoring that comment changes the meaning of it or the gravity of it at all. No, but if it was followed up with something else, it would take it like it would heighten the level of weirdness like ten times. Yes, but it's still inappropriate. I don't think it's okay. Here's what I'm gonna argue. I don't think it's appropriate. Like, I didn't read that and automatically go like I'm fucking hot ship. I went and then I went nice. People who watched the videos saw me roll my eyes just now. I just like was like,...

Oh, it's nice. I don't think it's nice. It's harassment. So this is the thing, because you always quote back to me my saying, which is like I'm not in the business of getting offended on behalf of other people. It's so my I'm saying, I am defining this incident as harassment, but I'm not saying to you you were harassed. You have to accept that. I'm saying that was harassment and that personally, I do not stand for that behavior. That's what I'm saying. But also, you said that if it happened to me, you would be angry. Yes, because it's about how I feel. I think that it's I feel about my me getting ARASS. You weren't harassed about I'm saying that if it was flipped and it was someone saying Christen's a babe, you said you would be angry about would and I would say it's harassment and say how fucking inappropriate it was. Okay, great, so we're in agreement and I know that I'm gonna listen to back to this and think this is absurd. Right, but can we just like define the fact that, and let's also define and really pin that this comes from a place of deep insecurity about how I look. So I don't no, it's not, but it is relevant to my feelings. It felt validating and it felt like a compliment and they left me the funk alone. Okay, right, seek validation. If I got cat called, I would be like, I'll fucking stab you in the eyes, mate. Right, but that it was not dangerous. I don't feel threatened, I don't feel scared. I'm like Nice, leave me alone, I'm involved with my day. That's how I feel. I felt like, Oh, a compliment. Oh, that's weird someone sees me like that. But I will say that when I was then posting stories the next day, I was like, I don't want to look a certain way. Oh, I should look ugly. I don't look like I was trying as well. Right, that's so interesting, but that's that's my whole feelings on the matter. Well, great fun, I think that, but I think you can understand. I can understand. I don't agree that. But again, if it happened to someone else, we would both be like, let's fucking tear him apart, let's stick a rusty fork in their eyeball. Okay, this is the thing. If I saw that, whether it was about me or you, and I was doing the stories, if there had been me like I asked her the secrets, I was responding like, posting the stories, and I saw that and it was like, I went either it was like Chris, I think Kristen is a babe. I think Hannah is a babe. Either way, I would have shared that and said, do not fucking do this, this is not acceptable. That would have been my actual reaction in the moment, and it would have been to do with power social relationships, like you don't have the right just because fucking our faces are on this all the time, you don't have the right to harass us via instagram stories. So the other thing I'll say, which is unfortunately against what I've just said. Fine, where all very nuanced, is that I think it's very telling to come to a...

...platform that is radical feminist progressive views and think that that would work totally. It's just like, fucking boy, it's in a way, it's ten times more aggressive, purely by virtue of the fact that it's like you're taking a huge risk, guest, which is fun, not brave. The other thing is, I think, with with that line of thinking, is like we do have, like, Um, not a lot of men, percentage wise, but we have numbers wise, like quite a lot of men who are on our platform, and this is not anything personal. I don't I don't ever want to say like they're all ship but even within the like, even within a space that we have created, which is like a radical feminist, progressive space. There are still men that do stuff and we're just's like fucking men. I would like to talk about one. Oh really, yeah, okay, if you're gonna like it, but I want to when lead up to the election, maybe a week before, a man messaged our page and the message, essentially, it was to the effect of really love what you do, but a lot of my guy friends won't be able to get behind you as radical feminist hosts. So do you know any pages that are like yours that you could recommend for me to share with my friends? And I find this to be probably one of the most offensive messages we've ever received. Can I talk about this? He's going to listen to it. I don't think you'll know. Okay, I'll. Can I lighten it then? I just don't know if we should, because we responded to it, but like, it's he messaged our page, it's our fucking page. Yeah, I'm sorry, but it's so offensive to me. Okay, we're going to leave all that in that our disagreement is now, do you think? Okay, I just think, like we responded to him. I'm not going to call this person out. He's not going to be identified and if you don't like it, that's fine, but to me, I have fucking grown a fucking platform of over thirty people for this space and you have the fucking goal to message me and say sorry, you're a bit too much. Can you show me something that would work for my guy friends? He also said, is there a podcast similar to yours that's hosted by men? Didn't he? I think there was something. I'm not sure about that. Actually, I think it was more just like, can you point to things that are like your content, that are maybe more it's more about the we're not palatable. It's really hurtful to me because you've asked us to take the time out of our day to resource you with things that aren't us because we're too much or it won't work or and I just think, why don't you fucking try having a conversation with your guy friends about why our content is good or is valuable or why it's not extreme or radical or whatever the funk you want to call it? But to task us with resourcing you because you think we're too much like that's really I don't know. That just gets to me in such a very specific way. I also think one of the worst parts about it. Um, I think crazily, like you got more angry about this, but than me. Um, not because I don't find it outrageous, because I do, but I think that the like, the act of like writing that message and thinking I'm going to say. But I will say actually that I responded...

...and said something to the effect of, like, can you like let's just be a bit aware. This is not right and I actually thought it was quite kind message. Um, you stopped me from sharing it. Yeah, I don't. I don't like that. No, I think that's fair, that's good and I get uncomfortable other people do that. But basically, what you said to this person directly is what you just said on the pot, on the MICA, in a friendly way, I would argue. And then he messaged back and said something like he apologized and sort of said, I don't expect you to respond to this, but like, and it was very good about it. So I will absolutely say, if you're listening, I'm sorry for what I just did, because you reacted and responded extremely well. Don't be sorry. It still happened again. I think it comes back to what you said, like how could you write that with a straight face and think good and to me it just it says so much about the entitlement of people over my time, and that's actually what bothers me more about the parasocial relationship is sometimes people, and it's what bothers me more. Like I can ignore comments about, Um, how I look or Um, something that someone didn't like about our content. Like you know, we had a message the other week where someone said that we're just trying to be micro celebrities and self serving, self serving with the secret stuff, and that they came here for the politics and it's not that anymore and blah, blah blah, and that's fine. I literally said, well, you know, you can see the doors, it's not an airport, no need to declare your departure. I just think at the end of the day, people have this entitlement and this need to dictate to us what our content should be, because if they don't specifically like every post and every meme and every story, then they need to give us that feedback and that's fine. But you know what I do when I don't like someone's content? I meet unfollower. I don't like and comment, and that's not I mean. The thing is is that, you know, if I like someone's content, I'll stay for it. You know, like you're not going to write a message that's like can you please do more of these and no more of that because I don't like it. It's just that I don't work for free to create specifically for you, and you are but an individual among an infinite universe. Like, let's just have some fucking awareness. and to me it's actually the people who individually message us and say, can you find this guardian article for me that I read seven weeks ago, or can you tell me the difference between these two candidates in my electorate? And I just think every fucking day I try to equip you with the ability to do this yourself. Yes, yes, absolutely, Holy Shit, sorry, I just lost the plot. No, it's good. I think that Um. The other thing that I that I feel, and this is not really about Um, about me, but I think that a big difference between like a paras social relationship and like a true relationship Um is like sometimes I feel, okay, I'm gonna use myself as an example, but I obviously not a celebrity, but like, I'm just going to put myself in there, your self serving micro celebrity, please remind yourself about each and every day and like to be actually to be honest, like I was just going to be. I wasn't going to say this because I was like pretending like...

...it wasn't about me. But there have been times when this has happened in the past, like because, Um, when I was competing, when I was a power lifter, there was like a little like we had our own world, basically, and like there were people who were like known to each other and like there were other Um athletes who, like, in quote, knew me through my instagram and then, like you would meet in competitions and things and even though, like you didn't actually know each other. So there was a para of social relationship there. And there were times when I felt like people didn't want to meet me, they just wanted to like or like people didn't want me to meet their friends or their friends to meet me, but they wanted to show me to someone, like taking a picture to post and be like Oh, like, I'm going to look what I did. They're like showing, like I met Kristen, here she is. Do you get what I mean? I do, and you know what's sick is that, in a way, I get it more with like family, like when I achieve something in my personal life, it's like my family want to show a picture of me graduating yes, and they want to show their friends how many followers cheek has, but they don't want to talk to me or tell me I'm doing a good job or give a shit, and that really, really is hurtful. Exactly, exactly, and I do have a weird relationship with like having a public instagram, like personally, like a personal public instagram, because it actually was like a reef, like a repurposed Um like close friends instagram. So they're actually not that many people on there who I actually know, like it's mostly people who have come over from cheek and I do have a and there's nothing against any of those people, obviously, otherwise I would put it on private, but I do, like I do sometimes feel strange about that. So, like, in terms of my personality, like it's because I'm like a private person and I'm not a people I'm not really a people person, Um, and I'm not super social. But I think that for me, at the end of the day, like I think Um, and we've talked about on the podcast, like people who you've met who have said I really want to meet Kristian, and I think there's a difference between being like, I really want to meet your friend and like the person that you've grown something about, which I find very flattering. You right pretty much always say no, Um, but or you say no on my behalf. But I think there's a huge difference between people being really excited to meet someone who means a lot to them or has like I guess even that wording is strange because you don't know them who makes something, makes content that you really enjoy and you think you would like to know maybe discuss a certain thing with them, and there is a difference between that and just wanting to be like, oh my God, it's this person crazy. I want to look at them and like take a photo of them and then like funk off, like I don't want to engage with them, I just want to be like look, I met them and like I've definitely participated in that culture with like celebrities that I've met. It's more I don't want to be like hello,...

I like you, and it's just like can we take a picture? That's the thing. Like I met Tanni Plibersec a few months ago and all these people are going up to her and just like talking at her about something that she was literally mobbed. Yeah, she was, and they were crazy. They were like, my sister loves you. Can we face time her right now? Or three years ago? You said this and this is what the result was for me. And like she's so good at it. But I looked at that and thought pain. So when I went up to her, I just was like, take a photo, thank you so much, it funk away. And because I think like it's obviously what I'm there for, I want to take a photo and meet her. But like, she wasn't a Fuck U, and that's obviously also she's an elected person. She's not a celebrity. A celebrity. Yeah, and I can't even imagine what it actually is like for real celebrities, because I think we talked about a lot, like cheek is going to grow, and you know, they have like we've talked about, like we've been recognizing in public. Weirdly, something that freaks me out way more is a few people have like seen us and then will message and say, like I saw you, but I didn't stay hi and I'm like, fucking Hell, was like picking my notes, like and also I'll be at work or something and that's where they'll see me and I'm like, Oh, ship, that's I don't know how that works. Yeah, it's a weird one because people, I think people don't approach because they don't want to bother us. But then I guess like for some people they find it more like weird when someone's like, I saw you and I didn't say and I also know I also just want to say overall, like this sounds like a lot of complaining and I'm sorry about that, because I also know that when I listened to celebrities talk about this, I'm like, but I would fucking kill to be you. You wouldn't. I would. But what I mean is, like, I don't think we're celebrities. We're not. We're absolutely not, and I think it just illustrates that para social relation can be at any like you don't have to be a celebrity, course, but like there's people I follow that have maybe two thousand followers and I see them out in public and it's like I know them through a friend of a friend and when I see them, like I would never go up to you and talk to you, but I know who you are and that's weird. Yeah, there's people like that all the time. It's a friend of a friend. You recognize them from a photo you went to you you with them a few years ago there in a class you had. Like it's interesting the way that we perceive someone's life and we have the ability to watch someone's life, what they've curated of it through social media, and then we see them and we have an assumption about who they are and we actually have no clue. Well, I think the takeaway is, like, I think, because there are definitely people that you Um, you know new ten years ago and then you see them walking down the street and you're like, Oh, I haven't thought about that person for a while and you go home and you're like, tippy tappy, I'm going to stop them and see what they're up to and then, like, you know, you're on the third page of Google, like looking at some fucking award they got, like swimming at it's just hypothetical, Um, and I think that there is like that's just like being curious and like a bit nosy about different people, and I think that on its own, like, I mean objectively, it still sound a bit creepy, but I think that that's just normal human curiosity. But I think the key is like understanding, like that person doesn't know that I fucking did that, and that's okay and it's like that's a personality. The issue like not...

...tell them that you did, because that would be a bit weird and uncomfortable to hear. But it's okay that, like this kind of thing is one sided and it's okay that, like, you give your thoughts and comments on our posts, even if we don't know you. That is it's okay to do that. But I just think it's not okay when people don't understand that the relationship is one sided. I think that's where the problem arises. Like I don't think I mean there's lots of problems with celebrity in my opinion, but I don't think it's inherently evil that people like obsessed with Taylor swift and love her more than anything in the whole world. But I just think that the problem becomes when you think that your friends subconsciously. I think that the ultimate problem, and I'm someone who suffers from like, I get starstruck all the time by anyone. Right. The ultimate problem is is that they're just a person. Yeah, I think that everyone is just a person, which is just a person. Yes, if I matter, I'd shipped my pants personally, but she is just a person. I don't know if I'd be a friend, I don't know. I don't know if we'd get on. Yeah, and I have a deep appreciation for what she does and, you know, like those sorts of things and I'm obsessed with like her artistry and all these sorts of things, but she's just a person, you know. Um, and I think the thing is is that, like these things that we're talking about and these fears that we have and these experiences are we can talk about how they've affected us and the bad but at the end of the day, like, I wouldn't give any of it up for the fact that we have a platform when people listen to us and people give a funk about what we're saying. If you didn't find us a completely insufferable come back next Wednesday for a new episode. You could also find us on instagram at cheek media co or online at Cheek Media Dot Com. Donate you. Yes, that's the one that's the one.

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